Fat Skis, Hard Snow

[Highway Star]

Well, you make a fair point. In the interest of brevity, I failed to add "within reason" to my advice above. That said, I respectfully disagree with you. Your 110 skis from 2001 are nothing like the 110 skis of today. In the last five years, I gone from 75 to 94 to 100 to 108 underfoot. That may be the limit for the east. Current ski has camber plus early rise at both ends (Line SFB). No powder days so far and I am still happy I bought them. I do admit that it would be nice to have something skinnier for the super-icy days but if I can only ski on one ski, I'd rather make do with the SFB. They make everything so much fun.

His "110 skis from 2001" are Rossignol Axioms which were actually new in 1994. They are one of the best expert level powder skis EVER built and compare favorably with modern powder skis. I own two pairs, but also own modern pow skis.

If you are freeskiing ice on 108mm waist rockered skis, you clearly are not carving very many turns. If you want to skid all the time, fat skis will certainly make that easier.

 

[deadheadskier]

interesting. I knew they were a from a prior model year when I bought them new in the fall of 2000. Didn't realize they hailed from all the way back in 1994. I'd eventually like to replace them with a "modern" powder ski, but for now they still ski very well after 11 years and probably 150 days on them.

 

[deadheadskier]

heh

can still find them on ebay

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ROSSIGNOL-A...?pt=Skiing&hash=item5ae48fb963#ht_2128wt_1139

 

[atkinson]

Thank god I am on 118mm rockered waist skis, I wouldn't want to skid around on a pair of 108mm skis.

Remember when shaped skis came out and lots of people poo-pooed it? Now everybody pretty much accepts them as standard. Be prepared for this progression with rockered skis. The definition of wide has changed over time too. 80mm used to be considered fat ...

 

[kingslug]

85mm to 90mm is the optimal waist width for all around, east coast, expert level skiing.

Agreed!

 

[BenedictGomez]

The points being suggested are that for icy hard pack (where the OP was having some major problems) skinny skis are clearly the best tool for the job.

Exactly. Case in point, Whiteface this weekend.

Conditions were decent packed powder lower on the mountain, but rather icy higher up. Lets just say my Line Prophet 90s (a jack of all trades, master of none ski) stayed in the cozy comfort of the motel room in Lake Placid, in favor of my rather old Salomon XScreams that are 68mm underfoot and absolutely phenomenal at holding an edge on ice.

When I think of "conventional wisdom" I think of "go bigger". Go skinny is old school wisdom. Everybody these days says go fat. I think a lot of people that could be better served by skinnier hard pack skis (those that never or rarely get off the groomers) are being misled. I think the OP might fall into this category buying a fatter ski to improve his icy hard pack groomer skiing (!!!).

Yes, which leads us to.........

Yup, go get some. The world has changed. Every thing you have is now obsolete. You simply must buy the new version. It's better. Better for everything. Really. Please buy them. Buy them now, because next year we'll have something else to sell you and it will be too late to sell these.

THIS...

You had to get something 85 or 90. Then, 90 wasnt enough, so go 100. What's that you say, 110 to 120 is really Nirvana? Oh, I'll get those then.

It's the same as the golf industry. First the CCs of head size kept getting bigger, until they made a maximum allowable size. So now they fiddle with the shaft materials every year, the sole plate construction, moment of inertia, etc.... WTH they can think of to get you to buy the 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014 etc..... model. The ski industry is no different.

 

[atkinson]

I haven't skied anything narrower than 100mm in over a decade, so I must not be skiing right. If you've haven't tried a mix of wide/ rockered skis, but still have a strong opinion against them, no amount of talk is going to change your mind. Try before you deny.

Anything that makes skiing more fun and accessible for a wider range of skiers is good for the industry. Playing luddite and poo-pooing new technology may make you feel core, but it's just a pose.

 

[Highway Star]

I haven't skied anything narrower than 100mm in over a decade, so I must not be skiing right. If you've haven't tried a mix of wide/ rockered skis, but still have a strong opinion against them, no amount of talk is going to change your mind. Try before you deny.

Anything that makes skiing more fun and accessible for a wider range of skiers is good for the industry. Playing luddite and poo-pooing new technology may make you feel core, but it's just a pose.

I'm guessing that you haven't made a carved turn in a decade either, if ever.

 

[atkinson]

Ding ding! HS wins the prize for the best judging without having an actual clue.

Come on up big guy and we'll go for a little spin. Then you can trash talk. The lift ticket is on me.

 

[BMac]

HS, I bet watching you carve is like Jodie Foster's trip in contact. "So beautiful. Should have sent a poet."

 

[Glenn]

I'm guessing that you haven't made a carved turn in a decade either, if ever.

I have to give credit where credit is due...this made me LOL. True or not...it was funny.

 

[BenedictGomez]

I haven't skied anything narrower than 100mm in over a decade, so I must not be skiing right. If you've haven't tried a mix of wide/ rockered skis, but still have a strong opinion against them, no amount of talk is going to change your mind. Try before you deny.

Anything that makes skiing more fun and accessible for a wider range of skiers is good for the industry. Playing luddite and poo-pooing new technology may make you feel core, but it's just a pose.

You may be skiing "right" on your 110mm or 120mm or whatever, but you're certainly not skiing hard snow and ice conditions as well as you could be.

And frankly, I really dont understand why you're so adamant and attacking people in this thread, especially about a subject that is accepted as fact.

Sure, you can take a .50 caliber belt-fed machine gun pheasant hunting, but it doesn't mean it's the best weapon for that application.

 

[Highway Star]

Ding ding! HS wins the prize for the best judging without having an actual clue.

Come on up big guy and we'll go for a little spin. Then you can trash talk. The lift ticket is on me.

Are you calling me out for a ski off???

 

[Sick Bird Rider]

You may be skiing "right" on your 110mm or 120mm or whatever, but you're certainly not skiing hard snow and ice conditions as well as you could be.

And frankly, I really dont understand why you're so adamant and attacking people in this thread, especially about a subject that is accepted as fact.

Atkinson has not attacked anybody, in fact has defended himself against several attacks and simply offered to prove his point on the snow. Which is a lot more than a good portion of narrow-ski-minded people in this discussion are prepared to do.

SBR, signing out of this discussion for good and staying happily on my rocker. You guys are taking this way too seriously. It's just skiing for cripe's sake.

 

[JSHSKI]

Atkinson has not attacked anybody, in fact has defended himself against several attacks and simply offered to prove his point on the snow. Which is a lot more than a good portion of narrow-ski-minded people in this discussion are prepared to do.

SBR, signing out of this discussion for good and staying happily on my rocker. You guys are taking this way too seriously. It's just skiing for cripe's sake.

Thanks SBR / Atkinson and others who tried to offer input and have a discussion in response to my post. They are not the ones attacking anyone in this thread. They have remained patient and positive while being attacked by some and while others have said the attacks made them lol. I feel bad for folks who have to deal with the likes of the attackers on a regular basis. I can just log out and be rid of that attitude. SBR is so right. It's skiing and some of you need to relax.

 

[JSHSKI]

Stripes

Any of you homos talk about my skis and I'll Kill ya

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OnpkDWbeJs&feature=endscreen&NR=1

Relax Francis!

 

[tt431]

Oh, this is fun. Pass the popcorn please.

 

[mister moose]

Ding ding! HS wins the prize for the best judging without having an actual clue.

Come on up big guy and we'll go for a little spin. Then you can trash talk. The lift ticket is on me.

Wait, I might want in on this. What mountain are we talking about for this free lift ticket?

 

[atkinson]

I believe HS called me out. I was just offering to inform his opinion and don't want to travel for the opportunity. The ticket offer stands for HS at Sugarbush.

Thanks for bringing some reality to the interwebz, JSHSKI and SBR.

 

[JSHSKI]

The ticket offer stands for HS at Sugarbush. (said Atkinson)


Your offer has great potential to ruin an otherwise good ski day. Francis, I mean HS, would not be enjoyable to ski with under any circumstances, regardless of who won the carving contest. Somethings got his panties in a bunch.