LiftBlog Reports that Smuggs and Stowe are Exploring an Interconnect Gondola

[thetrailboss]

I have owned in VT for 15 years and pay pretty good attention to the politics up here. What makes you say the poitics are corrupt? I mean compaired to the other states that surround VT I get the impression that VT is the least corrupt.

"Least Corrupt" if you agree with those in power.

As stated, EB-5. And, more importantly, the state's response (or non-response).

 

[FBGM]

The EB5 program is a joke and should not be allowed in VT or anywhere in our country.

Peak Resorts and Mount Blow took full advantage of it to funnel money into their borderline bankrupt business. Used all the money in the most nonsense ways. Glad those in charge are gone and Vail is now there.

 

[Hawk]

I understand all about the EB-5 program. They missed the mark on that whole mess. But I do not believe that they entered into that agreement thinking or knowing how bad Q and Bill would F-them. There are many states that have similar programs. Is that the only thing that is corrupt? What else? I mean compaired to NY with Cuomo and others, the Free State and other antics that are happening in NH, and that Wing nut in ME with his questionable dealings, VT is not nearly as bad and I would add that with all the Nimby watchdog people and groups, corruption would be called out even more. I also think that having a Republican Governor has balanced things out a bit over the 3 or 4 years.

Lets face it most state governments have some issues. It think VT has less.

 

[thetrailboss]

I understand all about the EB-5 program. They missed the mark on that whole mess. But I do not believe that they entered into that agreement thinking or knowing how bad Q and Bill would F-them.

No, they accepted the campaign contributions, gave Q special access to Shumlin, and ignored concerns from the investors. All the meantime Shumlin directly told investors that the state "audited" these projects and that the EB-5 Center was the best one because of the State's involvement when, at the very least, they had no idea what they were doing. That smells pretty damn bad to me.

There are many states that have similar programs. Is that the only thing that is corrupt? What else?

There are a lot of folks in office and on "committees" and "boards" that have conflicts of interest. The owner of the state's largest "green" energy tech company sat on a state board that awarded funding for green tech projects. Guess who got most of the state funds? Him. When called out he threatened defamation lawsuits and it shut folks up.

And honest question: what has Bernie done in office other than get re-elected? I'll save you the time--nothing significant.

Still not convinced? Look at what happened to Burlington College when Mrs. Sanders took it over. What? You can't find it? That's because it is gone. She gave her kids jobs on the college's dime, ran the place into financial trouble, and left. No consequence at all for her or Bernie. A lot of jobs and educations cut because she treated it as a personal boondoggle.

I mean compaired to NY with Cuomo and others, the Free State and other antics that are happening in NH, and that Wing nut in ME with his questionable dealings, VT is not nearly as bad and I would add that with all the Nimby watchdog people and groups, corruption would be called out even more.

That's is not a good defense at all. There's more corruption elsewhere so Vermont is better. The bigger issue is that it has become a single-party dominated state and there is nobody holding that party accountable. It's the same thing here in Utah, just a red version.

I also think that having a Republican Governor has balanced things out a bit over the 3 or 4 years.

He has to deal with a super majority in the legislature. They now ignore him. Again, no accountability.

And 20 years ago I was saying the same things as you about how clean Vermont government was. It's not. It's just that because people agree with some of the stated political views they look the other way at the corruption and self-dealing that is going on. "If it's my party, they can do no wrong."

The only upside I will say is that despite corporate journalism dying, VT Digger does a great job independently reporting and holding folks accountable. But it is only one news outlet.

 

[Hawk]

What I do know is that trailboss with an axe to grind is someone not to go up against. I get it. You don't like whats going on. I will add that if you look hard enough you can say the same things about every governmental body. Whatever, I don't have a vote in VT so I'm not changing anything.

 

[thetrailboss]

What I do know is that trailboss with an axe to grind is someone not to go up against. I get it. You don't like whats going on. I will add that if you look hard enough you can say the same things about every governmental body. Whatever, I don't have a vote in VT so I'm not changing anything.

Axe to grind? No. Extremely disappointed about the situation? Yes.

And now a segue: will folks be talking about current events while riding in a gondola cabin between Stowe and Smuggs? Methinks probably not.

I also have to wonder if Vail is in discussions to buy Smuggs. It must be. The recent article's discussion about Smuggs benefitting from more skiers and riders in order to survive does not make any sense unless Smuggs is EPIC.

 

[BenedictGomez]

I get the impression that VT is the least corrupt.

That's a pretty shocking opinion given events of the last few decades.

 

[BenedictGomez]

No, they accepted the campaign contributions, gave Q special access to Shumlin, and ignored concerns from the investors. All the meantime Shumlin directly told investors that the state "audited" these projects and that the EB-5 Center was the best one because of the State's involvement when, at the very least, they had no idea what they were doing. That smells pretty damn bad to me.

State of Vermont absolutely knew, they pushed it, they lied (a ton), and seemingly nobody is going to be held accountable.

A quick LinkedIn review of the guy they put in charge of the oversight of the entire program had no financial credentials whatsoever to hold that position. I mentioned this at the time. It wasnt an accident, and it's a common recurring theme in financial corruption / scams. If you dont want someone to know what's going on underwater, you put someone in charge who's afraid to swim.

 

[thetrailboss]

State of Vermont absolutely knew, they pushed it, they lied (a ton), and seemingly nobody is going to be held accountable.

The Civil Matter with the State settled, so we will never hear under oath what happened. That said, the reporting from VT Digger is clear that Shumlin made a conscious decision, when he learned of the fraud, to let it continue. The argument appears to be so that the projects were completed and no jobs were lost. That said, he became an accomplice when he made this decision for the investors who were scammed when Stenger/Q was allowed to continue to fundraise.

Shumlin's consolation prize? Getting an adjunct position at Harvard to teach about his much-promised and failed single-payer system that never got off the ground.

 

[drjeff]

State of Vermont absolutely knew, they pushed it, they lied (a ton), and seemingly nobody is going to be held accountable.

A quick LinkedIn review of the guy they put in charge of the oversight of the entire program had no financial credentials whatsoever to hold that position. I mentioned this at the time. It wasnt an accident, and it's a common recurring theme in financial corruption / scams. If you dont want someone to know what's going on underwater, you put someone in charge who's afraid to swim.

It's the age old adage of "How do you know when a politician is lying? Their mouth is moving"

And if folks don't think that their own ideological preferred polictician is lying and/or using the system for their financial gain, but only the other (non ideological preferred politician is doing that) then they truly are blisffully ignornant of the reality of modern day politics and the corruption behind it. The system is broken, and it seems like the one's who truly want to fix it are the one's that the system works the hardest to crush

 

[BodeMiller1]

Could eating cheesecake, help keep you skinny?

This guy gets it.

 

[BodeMiller1]

It's the age old adage of "How do you know when a politician is lying? Their mouth is moving"

And if folks don't think that their own ideological preferred polictician is lying and/or using the system for their financial gain, but only the other (non ideological preferred politician is doing that) then they truly are blisffully ignornant of the reality of modern day politics and the corruption behind it. The system is broken, and it seems like the one's who truly want to fix it are the one's that the system works the hardest to crush

In the United States many things are based on money and how much you have. For better or for worse that's how we keep score. Politicians have been lining their pockets with ill gotten gains as they always have and as they always will.

Meow

 

[BodeMiller1]

I have owned in VT for 15 years and pay pretty good attention to the politics up here. What makes you say the poitics are corrupt? I mean compaired to the other states that surround VT I get the impression that VT is the least corrupt.

I'd agree, Vermont is kind of the hippy / flower child of New England. No will to get rich; as they are happy with: food, booze and weed .
New Hampshire is the cranky old grandfather sitting on a pile of cash.
Massachusetts is the socialist aunt everyone has given up on.
Maine is a poor cousin that forgot how to farm (except for weed ) and is trying to claw it's way out of poverty through tourism (good luck with that) .
Connecticut is now part of the empire of New York. So, they don't count.
Rhode Island is too small to count. They still posses the mansions of glory, butt no one lives in them except for they help.

The silver lining is: we're down to four states and the Red Sox will take it all next year. Extra awesome sauce please.

"Once again you've crystalized my thoughts into one concise cluster..."


You don't get into real government corruption until you get to the house and senate in D.C. Local politicians have people watching them to closely. Around here the churches are where you see the most graft (butt, they keep it internal). Same as it ever was.

I think the whole board will agree at least our presidents are honest. Yep

 

[Hawk]

How about that gondola. I bet they get a really good deal with EB-5 dollars and line the pockets of the local and state politicians.

I figured I would get back on topic. ;-) Just aligning myself with the majority opinion. That way I can be more correct.

 

[machski]

In line with thread, I still fail to see how this would extend a lifeline to Smuggs. Yes, it would Garner some attention but at this point, without details on an interchangable pass, it's about as good as slipping the rope between PC and DV. Unless you have both passes, how much is it worth to a skier/rider?

 

[raisingarizona]

It’s going to happen. I’ll bet ya everything I own.

 

[BodeMiller1]

How about that gondola. I bet they get a really good deal with EB-5 dollars and line the pockets of the local and state politicians.

I figured I would get back on topic. ;-) Just aligning myself with the majority opinion. That way I can be more correct.

If we can get one gondola out of the deal then I'm prepared to forgive everyone . Sometimes you have to break some eggs.

 

[BodeMiller1]

In line with thread, I still fail to see how this would extend a lifeline to Smuggs. Yes, it would Garner some attention but at this point, without details on an interchangable pass, it's about as good as slipping the rope between PC and DV. Unless you have both passes, how much is it worth to a skier/rider?

It wouldn't monopolies unchecked will always win.

Smuggs is to Stowe what the independent drug store is to CVS.

File under - Not Good

 

[cdskier]

In line with thread, I still fail to see how this would extend a lifeline to Smuggs. Yes, it would Garner some attention but at this point, without details on an interchangable pass, it's about as good as slipping the rope between PC and DV. Unless you have both passes, how much is it worth to a skier/rider?

Agreed. And every article keeps saying that there are no talks about merging. If that is genuinely the case, then there needs to be some details on what mutual access would look like. If there's no interchangeable pass/access, then I don't see this helping Smuggs much either...

 

[thetrailboss]

In line with thread, I still fail to see how this would extend a lifeline to Smuggs. Yes, it would Garner some attention but at this point, without details on an interchangable pass, it's about as good as slipping the rope between PC and DV. Unless you have both passes, how much is it worth to a skier/rider?

That's why I think that, despite what Smuggs says publicly, Vail is looking to make Smuggs truly EPIC. That is the only logical explanation. Now, of course, Smuggs could just be one of the few affiliates with Vail on the Epic Pass. That said, the ownership is old and I bet wants to retire.