VAIL SUCKS

[kingslug]

Maxing out a system puts a lot of stress on it...they may not want to do that.

 

[Newpylong]

Not really... Same water pressure running 8 pumps or 4. Same compressed air pressure running 6 compressors or 2.

 

[doublediamond]

So Stowe only has snowmaking on 3 trails even though they currently only have 35 of 127 trails open? I doubt that's the case, so I really dont think that's a comprehensive snowmaking report.

Gondolier takes a lot of water to cover. No reason to run the other two mid mountain boosters if you have very little water left over.

 

[kingslug]

Not really... Same water pressure running 8 pumps or 4. Same compressed air pressure running 6 compressors or 2.

Um....there's more to it than that...
But it's their deal..they do what they want.

 

[cdskier]

Um....there's more to it than that...
But it's their deal..they do what they want.

There's a difference between not completely maxing it out which is understandable and running it at only about 50% capacity (if the numbers from 2016 were accurate on the max GPM). That's a lot of wasted opportunity to be getting more trails covered...

 

[BodeMiller1]

Snow Phone

"We have x of 50 trails. Packed Powder"

Click

I blame the internet

 

[BodeMiller1]

Maxing out a system puts a lot of stress on it...they may not want t

Not really... Same water pressure running 8 pumps or 4. Same compressed air pressure running 6 compressors or 2.

I'd think it would be good for the system to run it. See what it can do maxed out. Ponds should have the water. That's another thing about Killington, riding a lift in early season when they're making snow it's amazing. From one lift ride to the next, the amount of snow they can make. Always cool to see.

 

[drjeff]

There's a difference between not completely maxing it out which is understandable and running it at only about 50% capacity (if the numbers from 2016 were accurate on the max GPM). That's a lot of wasted opportunity to be getting more trails covered...

Some of it might also be if they're running on trails that are hogs of their air/water capacity, what's left capacity wise might not be enough to run another trail or two at the same time, especially say if they're running a bunch of water thrugh the guns on Gondolier in an effort to maximize production from each gun verses just traying to maximize a total number of guns running with less water per gun.

They're pros and they know what they're doing and why they're doing it the way that they are. With MLK weekend less than 2 weeks away, and what I am guessing was overall lackluster numbers during X-Mas week, most every area right now is likely going to try and make the most of MLK weekend, and hope that Mother Nature stops the monsoon's she's been throwing the Northeast the last month or so

 

[doublediamond]

Exactly. Just not enough capacity. AIG never ran much more than Gondolier.

AIG did a lot of work to the snowmaking. Automation (though it was all on York Borax which are air hogs), new pipe, 4 new pump houses, replaced all old non-York air hogs with Ratnik Baby Snow Giants, and added fans and HKD towers. I don’t recall any significant pumping capacity increase - just higher pressures. It was to allow more water down in quicker time by improving air efficiency and adding the fans to maximize water in warmer windows.

 

[cdskier]

If there's not enough capacity to run more and they outright stated recently that they're using ~3.5-4K GPM, then that means either the previous number mentioned 8 years ago (7K) was wrong at the time or something changed and the system is no longer capable of that (replaced pumps with different ones, etc). My whole original point was that I was surprised Stowe's capacity was so low. I always thought it was higher (based on the fact that it was mentioned years ago that it was "upgraded" to 7K GPM potential when they did a lot of other upgrades late in the AIG days).

 

[jimmywilson69]

I bet Spruce and Mansfield are separate pumping systems from a common water source and combined they are 7k GPM. Didn't appear in the report they were making snow on Spruce, but probably are on at least main street. Since that is never open to the public, that may have lead someone to not know or think about whatever is being used at Spruce.

 

[doublediamond]

Meadow is on Spruce

 

[kingslug]

Can't assume everything is in working order as well...

 

[Newpylong]

Um....there's more to it than that...
But it's their deal..they do what they want.

Unless you're talking about turning on additional booster stations which adds complexity (but not necessarily stress), in a system's most basic form, there is not much more to it than that. Every pump (and control valve) has a discharge setpoint. Same for the compressors and cooling systems. Adding additional water flow or compressed air into the system may increase velocity, but not necessarily stress. The water still needs to go somewhere. If it wasn't, the control valves would not allow the water to be discharged at such a rate. Additional flow is either going out more on hill equipment, or it's being dumped out the bleeds. The number one cause of stress on a distributing system is water pressure, the worst being directly downstream from the pumps.

Long story short, when someone says that "maxing out" a system is causing more stress, they are referring to complexity, not stress. More water flow, more lines charged, more equipment on the hill to keep an eye on, etc and so on.

 

[ColdRain&Snow]

I don’t think any of us will be happy until these places can lay a foot over their entire trail system during these post-rain 2 day below freezing periods.

 

[kingslug]

Yeah...I had my share of keeping an eye on systems like this..for 30 years...
I don't miss it...
We pumped about 60,000 gpm

 

[snoseek]

well we get snwstake cams at wildcat/attitash complete with clock and thermometer minus the actual stake.

 

[kingslug]

MRG has the best cam..I used to watch it at work

 

[AdironRider]

I don’t think any of us will be happy until these places can lay a foot over their entire trail system during these post-rain 2 day below freezing periods.

Even then the crowd here would complain about their snow report not being a novel with every minute detail of their operations plan being broadcast to the three people that give a shit.

99% of the skiing public does not care about the intricacies of their snowmaking plans. They look at a trail count and roll.

 

[oldfartrider]

I check out multiple ski cams every day at work. Even ski areas in Europe. I love the Information Age