Driving a Groomer. How awesome would that be?

[newenglandskier1]

Does anyone here know the requirements for operating a groomer at a ski resort. What licences are necessary, and where do you get groomer-related training? This would be such an awesome job!

 

[billski]

The groomers I know worked their way up from the bottom. I mean really bottom. Like trash and general maintenance. I rode with one for an hour at Sugarbush last year. It's a real art. And yes, they do get themselves stuck sometimes. It is such an essential job nowadays, and you really have to trust them to do a good job. Not suprisingly, Sugarbush has a planner that maps out the grooming strategy each day. Each driver is given his marching orders for the night.

It is a real trip coming down the steep trails at night, but the most amazing part is not accelerating downward, like you do on skis/boards.

 

[riverc0il]

I imagine this would not be the best job if you like to ski a lot. Then again, there are not a lot of ski industry jobs that work well with skiing schedule unless the job is flexible and/or requires on snow time.

 

[snoseek]

I imagine this would not be the best job if you like to ski a lot. Then again, there are not a lot of ski industry jobs that work well with skiing schedule unless the job is flexible and/or requires on snow time.

Why not? most grooming happens when the mountain is closed, seems like it would be one of the better jobs to get out there frequently.

 

[riverc0il]

Assuming you had to work all night, from the time the mountain closed until dawn, you would essentially be getting off work right when the mountain opened. You could essentially look at this from the perspective of doing night skiing after work. Perhaps once or twice a week, but not likely every day since you probably have other things you need to get done during the week... especially if you are going to spend you two days off skiing (assuming groomers work a standard 40 hour work week?). Even if you started skiing right after stopping work, you couldn't ski all day, because you would need to get some sleep before beginning your next shift after the resort closes that next day.

Personally, I would never take a job at a ski area. No way. If I wanted to maximize my days and time on snow, I would probably go the route JD did and be a chef at a restaurant that doesn't open until the ski areas close. Live close to the mountain and not need to get to work until after the lifts close. Any other ski town type job with those types of hours would be the win. Not a lot of professional jobs on that schedule though.

Essentially, I think being a groomer would be no better for accessibility than being in a professional job living near the mountain. If anything, being a groomer would be worse because you are seasonal and can not take days off because of a powder day (at least at most mountains, because we all know most people love to hit the mountains right after a dump to ski the groomers).

 

[AdironRider]

Wrong.

One of my good friends here in Jackson runs a groomer here and I ride with him every other day or so. There are several aspects to your arguments that are just off. First, the notion of skiing open to close, day in and day out just doesnt happen if your skiing 100+ days a year. Sure, when your getting 50 you can pull that kind of time on the hill, but for reasons you mentioned, thats not possible if your skiing everyday. Your legs give out, there are errands to run, the list goes on. More often than not your riding hard for 3-5 hours then going about your business. You ski everyday, theres no need to keep running down chopped up bowls or skied off groomers just to get in another run. Your not skiing first chair to last unless its an epic pow day or youve got friends visiting. Second, most groomers dont work from dusk till dawn, there are actually two separate shifts (usually 4-12 and 12 - 8 or 9 in the morning). Either one (outside of getting used to the schedule) really leaves you with plenty of energy for the hill the next morning. Plus you know where the goods are usually.

 

[snoseek]

Wrong.

One of my good friends here in Jackson runs a groomer here and I ride with him every other day or so. There are several aspects to your arguments that are just off. First, the notion of skiing open to close, day in and day out just doesnt happen if your skiing 100+ days a year. Sure, when your getting 50 you can pull that kind of time on the hill, but for reasons you mentioned, thats not possible if your skiing everyday. Your legs give out, there are errands to run, the list goes on. More often than not your riding hard for 3-5 hours then going about your business. You ski everyday, theres no need to keep running down chopped up bowls or skied off groomers just to get in another run. Your not skiing first chair to last unless its an epic pow day or youve got friends visiting. Second, most groomers dont work from dusk till dawn, there are actually two separate shifts (usually 4-12 and 12 - 8 or 9 in the morning). Either one (outside of getting used to the schedule) really leaves you with plenty of energy for the hill the next morning. Plus you know where the goods are usually.

Your right I think. I was always under the impression that groomers run seperate shifts like you mentioned. This would leave plenty of time for turns, plus it's not as physically demanding as other jobs. (I personally know how bad a night on the line after a day of skiing can be) .

 

[crank]

I was, a long time ago, a ski bum in Lake Tahoe. A friend of mine drove a groomer at Heavenly Valley. It was the best, I mean the best job in ski town.

Here's why - He reported to work at 4PM and got off around 11-12. He could ski all day, every day and report to work right at mid mountain. If he wanted he could still go out for a few beers after work and still get a good night's sleep and ski the next day.

How did he get the job? He played on a beer league basketball team with the guy who ran the fleet at Heavanly. It's not what, but who, ya know.

 

[BushMogulMaster]

Yep, as some have alluded to, most grooming shifts are 8 hour shifts. 4-12 and 12-8. It's fun, and not physically demanding (though it is mentally demanding).

You need a valid drivers license, and if you want to do a good job, you ought to have some blade work experience. Nearly every snowcat you'll come in contact with now has a twelve way blade and a power tiller. You've really gotta be focused, and understand what your blade is doing and what your tiller (or c-bar, or roller, or powder maker as it may be) is doing. It's fun, yes. But it's not just kicking back and driving around. A lot of cats are also stick controlled. If you're not used to operating tracked vehicles with sticks, it'll take a little while to really get the feel for it. It's just another branch of heavy equipment operations. If you're good in a dozer, it will transfer well to the cat. But snow is an entirely different animal than dirt, and it often varies from night to night.

Now that I got that out of the way... it's great. If you're interested, see if you can find a mountain that would let you do a ride-along to see if you really want to pursue it. The actual grooming training you will likely receive on the job through ride-alongs and through operating with an experienced operator talking you through things from the passenger seat. It's not all that hard to land a groomer position, but you need to put some effort into it if you want to do a good job.

 

[learn2turn]

I would have thought that groomers come from guys that run construction machinery the other three seasons and don't have much to do in winter. The skills would transfer pretty well, wouldn't they?

 

[dirtbagking]

You need to be able to stay awake and alert ALL night while doing a really boring job. The excitement wears off on your second week. It becomes like mowing the lawn...ALL night long, no matter which shift you are on. I have seen many guys and girls who thought they could ski and groom but they don't last long. It is a tough job and it can really suck if you aren't good or prone to screwing up. Accidents and funny mistakes with groomers could be another thread.

 

[BushMogulMaster]

You need to be able to stay awake and alert ALL night while doing a really boring job. The excitement wears off on your second week. It becomes like mowing the lawn...ALL night long, no matter which shift you are on. I have seen many guys and girls who thought they could ski and groom but they don't last long. It is a tough job and it can really suck if you aren't good or prone to screwing up. Accidents and funny mistakes with groomers could be another thread.

I think that depends a lot on the individual. I was just talking to a groomer who's been at it for nearly 20 years. He said when he was a little younger, he would ski over 100 days every season, and groom every night. He's still grooming, and still loves it.

Perhaps it also depends on WHERE you're grooming? I mean... yeah, grooming at a small mountain where you do the same thing every night would get boring real fast. But how about some bigger mountains? Sugarbush, Stowe, Sugarloaf. What about Winter Park, Mammoth, etc.?

 

[drjeff]

Until this year, I never really had an idea as to how much time and effort went into grooming a run, especially a major run. My new place at Mount Snow has a great view of almost all the Main Face, and on a clear night, you can see the lights of the groomers (and many nights a bunch of their fan guns) all night long on the mountain. That combined with the telescope I have has let me see that many nigths on the heavy traffic runs, it's not just simply 1 side by side pass over the width/length of the trail, but some serious snow moving that goes on. I've seen them many nights (and not just right after a freeze up), literally dig up the top 1 to 2 feet of a trails base, move the snow around, and then finally HOURS later smooth out and give the trail it's final dressing of corduroy!

They actually there's a really neat article in this months Ski Area Management Magazine about technology that's being developed using a groomer based sonar like system, GPS, and computer controlled automated snowmaking guns to more efficiently make and groom the snow on a trail and be able to monitor everything from a computer in the mountain operations building. It's in a wide scale trial at Alpe d'Huez in France.

Short version of how this system works, the snow is made, and the snowcat with the sonar system grooms it out. The GPS system uploads the snowdepth data to the main computer, and in subsequent days, the grooming supervisor can give the cat driver a specific plan about where snow needs to be moved. The cat driver gets instananeous feed back on an in cat computer screen. Now the really cool thing, is that when tied into a fully automated snowmaking system, the computer will judge if certain guns need to be turned on and in which direction they need to be angled to cover up "thin spots"! The article also said that in many case "efficient" making and grooming of snow like this will allow a ski area to save money and actually need to make less snow for the same if not better product for the consumer! I.E. instead of getting huge 10 foot deep whales in 1 area and a foot in others, you'll end up with a consistant 2.5 to 3 feet across the trail! Cool stuff!

 

[jaywbigred]

...and eventually the cats will be guided by gps and/or remote alone, putting the groomers out of a job...it'll start on the slopes that require the least skill to groom, but evetually take over most of the grooming duties...no?

how many years away from that are we? 5-10? 50?

 

[millerm277]

...and eventually the cats will be guided by gps and/or remote alone, putting the groomers out of a job...it'll start on the slopes that require the least skill to groom, but evetually take over most of the grooming duties...no?

Seems unlikely to actually happen to me. Too many variables involved in grooming for it to really be feasible for a computer to do the task in my semi-educated opinion.

 

[BushMogulMaster]

The day that snowmaking and grooming become 100% (and I mean truly 100%) automated is the day I quit working in mountain ops. What next? Robotic auto-lift-mechanics? Virtual Mountain Manager Professional Edition? No thanks. This is a hands-on business. Technology must compliment manpower, not replace it.

 

[deadheadskier]

Never really had an interest in it. I can definitely see the appeal of driving around the impressive rig, tilling the snow and knowing where the goods will be the next morning.


That said, my best jobs ski bumming were bartending at fine dining restaurants. I worked 2 until 10:30, 11:00 at the latest, went out to the bars until 1, bed by 2, up at 8, on the hill from 8:30 until 1:30, home for an hour nap, then back to work. The fine dining gigs weren't as fun as the night club gigs, but you make close to the same money and are done with your shift at 11, not 2AM.

Biggest benny for the bartender over the groomer? Chicks dig bartenders

 

[BushMogulMaster]

Biggest benny for the bartender over the groomer? Chicks dig bartenders

You know how my parents spent their first anniversary??? In a snowcat with a bottle of champagne! Doesn't get any more romantic than that! :lol:

 

[ccskier]

That said, my best jobs ski bumming were bartending at fine dining restaurants. I worked 2 until 10:30, 11:00 at the latest, went out to the bars until 1, bed by 2, up at 8, on the hill from 8:30 until 1:30, home for an hour nap, then back to work. The fine dining gigs weren't as fun as the night club gigs, but you make close to the same money and are done with your shift at 11, not 2AM.

Biggest benny for the bartender over the groomer? Chicks dig bartenders

Yeah but then you get a headache from sitting there with the owner of the hotel watching him drink wine and smoke cigars night after night after night.

All kidding aside, I bet you get to see some cool stuff out there. Animals, weather, paranormal stuff, whatever.

 

[deadheadskier]

Yeah but then you get a headache from sitting there with the owner of the hotel watching him drink wine and smoke cigars night after night after night.

Good Point :lol:

Then again, I've never sampled so many good wines ever in my life as I did at the hof' with Mr. G. The head aches were certainly more due to my own consumption then the smoke from his cigars.