VAIL SUCKS

[snoseek]

This happens all over the place on the corporate side, but if true, this is bogus accounting aimed to justify and/or obfuscate the notion that Cannon is a money pit. Looping in lease income from another property and saying "NH-owned ski areas" are breakeven is putting lipstick on a pig. It will never cease to amaze me that my native NH continues to contort itself into thinking that operating a recreational property for the upper-middle class + should take a minute its government's limited time and money. Boy do I love Cannon though.

I really don't think the place is a money pit. Also cannon has all types that ski there not just wealthy people...it's got some good deals for nh residents and is overall more approachable than its neighbors for cost and learning.

 

[urungus]

Best i can determine the current sunapee lease is up in 2028. Problem as I understand it, the state of NH may own the land but vail owns the infrastructure at sunapee. No way is the state of NH cutting a seven figure check to vail resorts.

Had a lengthy conversion with a CMAC member over the summer, impression i got was cannon as currently operated is not viable without the sunapee subsidy. On a somewhat unrelated note, he was confident cannon would get the tram funds. He was also proud of snowmaking repairs made over the summer.

I really don't think the place is a money pit. Also cannon has all types that ski there not just wealthy people...it's got some good deals for nh residents and is overall more approachable than its neighbors for cost and learning.

According to https://www.newenglandskiindustry.com/viewstory.php?storyid=718

“The State of New Hampshire remains the owner of the land and legacy assets at Mount Sunapee. Including option years, the current lease runs through 2048. Under the terms of the lease, the operator must pay the state $150,000 per year, plus 3% of gross revenue. Since the start of the lease, all Sunapee lease payments have been used to finance debt accumulated at Cannon Mountain.”

Who would be funding / owning any new Sunapee chairlifts ? Anyone know about the option years (who has the option and when)

 

[BodeMiller1]

I really don't think the place is a money pit. Also cannon has all types that ski there not just wealthy people...it's got some good deals for nh residents and is overall more approachable than its neighbors for cost and learning.

Cannon for it's size is more of a middle down class place. Famous for Mexican chrome (duck tape) and releasing Bode Miller into the World Cup world and of course The Bears.

 

[KustyTheKlown]

i have never associated cannon with 'upscale'. quite the opposite. especially with loon catering to that market just down the road.

 

[deadheadskier]

You know who probably loses out big time if they privatized Cannon? The FSC. I doubt a private operator would carve out as much real estate for the race club as the state does. I bet a private operator would push for more trails cut and more widening at Mittersill too.

 

[2Planker]

i have never associated cannon with 'upscale'. quite the opposite. especially with loon catering to that market just down the road.

Upscale ??? Not in NH.
VT absolutely, NY definitely
But not NH or ME for that matter

 

[thebigo]

You know who probably loses out big time if they privatized Cannon? The FSC. I doubt a private operator would carve out as much real estate for the race club as the state does. I bet a private operator would push for more trails cut and more widening at Mittersill too.

No question NH seniors would lose out the most in a privatization scenario. Dad's unlimited pass was maybe $144 this year?

One thing I did not realize was every athlete training at mittersill pays a significant annual facilities fee to fund operations at mitttersill. This fee is in addition to coaching, passes, race fees, etc.

Edit: dad informs me NH senior veteran unlimited was $176.

 

[snoseek]

They put that tbar in I believe. They kick in hard for snowmaking as well I've heard. That training slope is kept real nice and man can you let em run on that slope!

 

[snoseek]

Also yeah the vet pass is a killer deal. I will forever jump on that

 

[thebigo]

Also yeah the vet pass is a killer deal. I will forever jump on that

Looking forward to skiing with you next year my friend.

 

[AdironRider]

Very few ski areas get the financial support from the local ski team that Cannon does from FSC. Agree the senior and veteran deals being the first axed under private ownership.

I’m sort of town in the senior deal personally. For every senior that could use the discount, there are three more rich guys with third homes in Franconia that could more than afford to pay market rate.

 

[deadheadskier]

I read Telluride is ending their senior discounts. They probably have come to the same conclusion. But that's Telluride.

I certainly hope I can still get a deal when I'm a senior. The healthcare costs I see my parents deal with in their 70s brought them from Upper Middle Class status to much more budget conscious in a hurry.

 

[thetrailboss]

Vail Is Laying Off 14 Percent of Corporate Employees. Here’s Why Skiers Should Care.

The global ski resort behemoth is cutting 14 percent of its corporate staff after a tough year. But will its new business strategy affect skiers?

www.outsideonline.com

 

[BodeMiller1]

Hmmm

Can they hold onto Vail? Does Vail own Vail?

 

[EPB]

I really don't think the place is a money pit. Also cannon has all types that ski there not just wealthy people...it's got some good deals for nh residents and is overall more approachable than its neighbors for cost and learning.

Let's be real. What percentage of skiers do you think are below median income ? Canon obviously not Stowe but skiing isn't soccer or basketball either.

 

[EPB]

i have never associated cannon with 'upscale'. quite the opposite. especially with loon catering to that market just down the road.

Nether have I which is why I didn't call Cannon 'upscale'. I just said that clientele are most likely members of the upper middle class or higher which makes it a weird vanity project. I didn't even broach the fact that a big chunk of said upper middle class and above visitors come from MA.

 

[1dog]

10 months old but power of marketing dollars prob. has something to do with it.

Not a terrible list and decent representation of actual conditions. . . last year anyway:

 

[thetrailboss]

10 months old but power of marketing dollars prob. has something to do with it.

Not a terrible list and decent representation of actual conditions. . . last year anyway:

Yeah the video that completely ignores Burke (open daily), S6, and Middlebury yet includes Magic. It makes me laugh. A true review would include all the major areas, not just the ones on this guy's passes. That guy likes to talk and, predictably. ranks the Epic/IKON areas pretty highly.

 

[BodeMiller1]

They forgot the no avalanche problem in the area. Meow

 

[urungus]

Yeah the video that completely ignores Burke (open daily), S6, and Middlebury yet includes Magic. It makes me laugh. A true review would include all the major areas, not just the ones on this guy's passes. That guy likes to talk and, predictably. ranks the Epic/IKON areas pretty highly.

Burke should have been included, but you can’t seriously be arguing that S6 and/or Middlebury should be ranked higher than Magic ?